House of the Dragon S3E7 REACTION: "The Dragon in Winter" — Sheepstealer's Fight, Aemond & Alicent's Poison Plot, Sunfyre Returns

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>> Will: Foreign.

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>> Sarah : Nerds. This is Scene N Nerd. I'm your host, Sarah

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Belmont, and with me as, ah, always, is our Mr.

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Producer, will Will Polk Carry. Doing tonight.

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>> Will: Doing very well, Sarah, I have to say. Sapphire

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said, let the me fire. Allison said, let me poison

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my son.

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I feel like this is a episode where I'm watching

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Fishes from the Bear.

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>> Sarah : How long have you, like, written all of that down?

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>> Will: Oh, I've been thinking about that all day. I mean,

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as soon as I'm actually even last night, I was

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just like. After I watched an episode, I felt like

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this is like the family reunion of, you know,

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especially, like, with, you know, with the fight

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there with poor, you know, sheep Steep Stiller

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getting scapegoated again. Poor sheets. I saw

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like, the Best of Day, which is someone did with.

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With sheep steer. And it was Kevin on stage at

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this where. Where I saw it, he had reposted.

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Someone had made this, and he is like, sheep

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stealer, like, talking about the fight and how

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Craxes basically, like, jumped him and then Sex

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and Seasmoke. Just basically, you know, he's like,

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I. I'll get him again. I'll get him again.

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Because, you know, I'm gonna bring that snook next

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time they go, you know, they sucker punch me this

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time, but I'm coming back.

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>> Sarah : well, well, let's get into that. That scene alone.

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Because that scene, I was initially when they were

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attacking Rhaenyra's dragon, Sera, I was like,

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whoa, buddy, slow down. I don't want another

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Rhaenyra. Can't afford to lose another dragon

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here. But then by the end of it, I was like, I

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don't like this. I don't like watching what's

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happening right now. It was brutal to watch them.

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Them take down Sheep Stealer and. And

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heartbreaking. And I thought that was done very

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well because that was. I was feeling that way even

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before Raya realized what was happening. And like,

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before she, like, had the. That part of me is

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being killed right now, and there's nothing I can

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do about it in that. In that heartbreak. But it's

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also very interesting because I. I was not

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expecting that to occur at all. And. But it makes

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a lot of sense because in this episode, you have

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Daemon off on some errand, and we see him at the

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Veil and we understand as well as he does that

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Rhea is not where she should be and is going off

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to try to pay some penance by either killing

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Vhagar or die trying. And meanwhile, Baela and

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Adam. So see that sheep stealer has a new rider

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and they report back. And then that leads to

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Rhaenyra being like, well, I'm gonna do this

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myself because I can't trust no one. And. And she

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arrives. But the funny thing is, until the dragons

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start to really fight each other, you don't

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realize there's so much size disadvantages. You

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may have a dragon, but some of you, you don't have

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the. The best dragon out there. But we saw that in

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last season also with the Sunfire as well, so. But

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I also love that it's all preemptive. More

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importantly, by, like, part two of this

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conversation that have started earlier this season

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between Damon and his daughter, he admits he has

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spent far too much time neglecting. And this is

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really his fault at the end of the day. And he.

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And I can appreciate, like, him even saying, I

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will help you, and then him bringing up, like,

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this idea. Again, the parallel between him and

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Aemond, they just keep coming because he admits,

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like, like, I didn't have a dragon when I was

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young and my mother died when I was three years

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old because you have to put in that, like,

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reminder that Damon has mommy issues. So again,

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all to parallel his nephew. But I really like the

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scene. Even though, like I said before, my gut

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reaction while watching was I don't like what's

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going on right now. This is. This is a bit much. I

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don't know why. Like, I. I just. I really was

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like, I do not like watching these. These

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creatures fight each other like that.

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>> Will: Yeah, it was pretty intense. I. I had the same

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reaction too with whenever. Whenever they were

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going down. One. I. It is still. Yeah. One.

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Because she still truly was. It's just. It's out

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there in the veil, minding. Minding its own

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business. And. And of course, you know, one of the

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things too, that with. With this scene leading up

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to it was Damon going to, you know, going to, you

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know, basically beg Lady Jane not to, like, tell

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Rhaenyra about this too. Getting to your point

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about, you know, again, this is his fault and, you

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know, all these things happening. So it was. Yeah.

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But, it was very disquieting for me seeing even

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though I know these are CGI battle, whatever, but

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it was just. It's just anytime you have animals in

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peril, whether it's, you know, dogs or dragons,

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it's hard to watch that. And so. And just how

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intense the fight was, with these creatures. And.

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And one of the things. I think they really did a

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good job with the steam just giving you the scale

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again. To your point about Veigar, Sunfire, like

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last season and this season, you know, with the

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standoff here, it's just the size of these

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creatures and the power of these creatures and.

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And. And even, you know, I couldn't help but think

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too, like, you know, some of the discussions that

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Ormond's had about, you know, the whole. With his

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whole thing about the target and is this bad magic

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or whatever. And even. Yeah. So all those things

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that sort of came together in this scene, and I

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thought it was very effective.

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>> Sarah : See, I keep thinking about how they've done such a

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good job this season of really, like, the show is

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called House of the Dragon. So these. We're

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focused on a family of dragon riders, and some,

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have dragons and some don't. And that. That sense

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of belonging, once you find it, like Rhea explains

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earlier this season, like, I am finally fulfilled.

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I'm complete. So in watching the dragons fight

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like that, it's almost as if their riders are

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fighting. So I think that's why when Cerex was

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getting attacked so much at the beginning of the

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battle, I was. My heart was breaking because

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that's Renaer. Like, part of her is dying. And

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then. And then on the flip side, like, to see

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someone cornered the way sheep stealer slash Rhea

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was in that moment, you're just like, it's unfair

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and you want to root for the underdog and. Or the

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underdragon. but. But it's. It's. They. They got

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the emotion because of work that they've done,

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whether. Whether it's what you brought up with

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Ormond's perspective or just the perspective of

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the Targaryens themselves on their. On their

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kinder with these beasts.

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But this also leads into a bigger. Another theme,

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because we. We never do one theme at a time. But

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another dynamic that has been at play for the past

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several episodes this season was between White

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Worm and Damon. Because what like miserys has

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known from the very beginning that that skull is

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not sheep stealer rider. She didn't know that it

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was Rhea and what Damon was trying to protect, I

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should say other. And that at the end of the day,

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he actually was doing a good and right thing, even

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though it was deceptive in nature. And so through

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this understanding about, oh, their sheep stealer

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has a new rider, quote, unquote, new and white

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white worms suddenly, like, again renews her or

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not renews. That's not the word. Returns to her

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soapbox of, Damon is an awful person. I don't know

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why you're with him. I should be your consort

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instead.

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>> Will: Yeah, yeah, they. They went there. It's Damon.

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Yeah, that. And they have a kid. Yes.

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>> Sarah : But they.

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>> Will: Yeah.

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>> Sarah : After. More importantly, the conversation she has

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with her old. I don't know what we would call her.

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Madame or. I don't know.

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>> Will: Oh, was that late? Because I was lady. That was

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like Lady Fry. Or was. I couldn't tell. I couldn't

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remember if that was Lady Fry from the. Whenever

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they were in the throne room.

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>> Sarah : Yeah.

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>> Will: Ah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. The family,

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basically. Yeah. I mean, basically, like your high

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morals to see you as a whore. You know, once a

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whore, always a whore.

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>> Sarah : Right, right. Once a. Always a whore. But there.

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There was a better line even before that, in the

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sense that, like, what power do you have? In

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truth, these people are not your own. Like, this

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idea of, like, you don't realize how much you

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being in this position for so long and around

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these people and in these castles and houses, that

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has changed you. Because for this season, we've

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seen White Worm sit at that council and continue

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to be like, no, no, no, you guys don't understand.

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Take it from me, I'm a commoner too.

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>> Will: Yeah.

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>> Sarah : This is what's going on. But her own greed and

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ambition for power and status. Over time, like, as

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she receives whatever this is, like, that

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perspective also goes away because we also have

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seen her over the past several episodes, whether

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it be her finding about. Out about Helena first

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or. Or this. This continued need to just kick

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Damon out of the house.

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>> Will: Yeah.

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>> Sarah : For lack of a better word. Like, she is, As, She

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is very much playing. Playing the game as well.

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Even though at the end of it, no, she will always

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be seen as the. And so that's why I, like, in that

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moment when she is initially starting as the White

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worm that we have seen this season and counts

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over, and then she suddenly, like, it's just like,

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well, at the end of the day, you just want sex for

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me. So you ain't getting it from Damon. Or you're

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not. You're not giving Damon any. Like, if this is

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my role, then, like, so be it. Like, there.

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There's an interesting, accept that occurs in that

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moment.

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>> Will: I think it was. I mean, there was this. You know,

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there was the sexual tension and. And that's been

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sort of a subtext throughout the season between

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the two of them.

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>> Sarah : Even last season.

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>> Will: And even last season. You're right. But I think

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there was also the. The power. You know, I. You,

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Know, I read there were several things going on

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there. Because, I mean, she's also had relations

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with Damon as well.

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>> Sarah : Yep.

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>> Will: And it was a weird, like, love triangle. Try, you

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know, triangulation. I mean, there were just so

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many things when I was, like, watching that scene

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through as far as, like, you know, what are her

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motivations here? Yeah, there is the course, the

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attraction, and just, you know, basically being

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the sex worker for. For. For the highborn. So

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there's that aspect of it, but then, there is

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that. That power dynamic too, where, you know, was

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she feeling some level of equalness to. To reward,

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just, you know, or that. Or closeness beyond just

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being this vessel to. For. For sexual pleasure? So

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it was.

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Yeah, I just. I just. There are a lot of things

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going on there when. Whenever that all went down.

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>> Sarah : I don't believe the latter. I don't. I. I think

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that in a way, as you. As you brought up, like,

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it's a weird triangle. Right. You've now been with

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both sides of the married couple, and we're not

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talking about a threesome. It's a very strange

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thing, however, like, Rhaenyra and Daemon's

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relationship is very strange. She is his niece,

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okay, by blood. So it's almost as though she's

239
00:12:22,809 --> 00:12:25,649
been around the Targaryens long enough where, if I

240
00:12:25,649 --> 00:12:31,169
create my own little weird dynamic and. And that

241
00:12:31,329 --> 00:12:35,889
kind of closeness allows for more pillow talk.

242
00:12:36,289 --> 00:12:40,239
Yeah, more. More secrets, like, mysterys. Re

243
00:12:40,239 --> 00:12:45,039
recognizes her job of whisperers, but it can be on

244
00:12:45,039 --> 00:12:49,239
both sides where you can have people talking to

245
00:12:49,239 --> 00:12:52,759
you about what's going on in King's Landing, and

246
00:12:52,759 --> 00:12:56,529
then. But now she's at, She's able to figure out,

247
00:12:56,609 --> 00:12:59,649
okay, what's going on with the Targaryen, like, at

248
00:12:59,649 --> 00:13:01,569
the end of the day, what are their secrets?

249
00:13:01,969 --> 00:13:04,929
Because if you can get a hold of those secrets,

250
00:13:05,419 --> 00:13:08,379
then you can wield that to even get further in

251
00:13:08,379 --> 00:13:12,059
this game, this political game. And. And it can be

252
00:13:12,059 --> 00:13:15,339
used as a safety net. So I think, again, using.

253
00:13:16,059 --> 00:13:20,779
Using sex to just get closer to these people, to

254
00:13:20,779 --> 00:13:23,899
get that secrets and to. To be vulnerable and

255
00:13:24,059 --> 00:13:25,819
allow them to lower their guards.

256
00:13:26,059 --> 00:13:28,299
>> Will: So, yeah, I think that that's a very good point. I

257
00:13:28,299 --> 00:13:31,339
mean, I think that's. Yeah, I think that's a very

258
00:13:31,579 --> 00:13:33,459
astute point that you made there. And I think

259
00:13:33,459 --> 00:13:35,379
that. I think that is part of it as far as her

260
00:13:35,379 --> 00:13:40,019
being the master, the mistress of, Whispers and in

261
00:13:40,019 --> 00:13:40,579
the Red Keep.

262
00:13:40,579 --> 00:13:44,339
>> Sarah : Let's talk about Ormond and King Darren. Okay, so

263
00:13:44,739 --> 00:13:48,819
there are 20,000 soldiers marching their way, and

264
00:13:48,899 --> 00:13:51,539
it's like they've known what I've Wanted to see

265
00:13:51,938 --> 00:13:54,739
they share Kristian's head on a stick. I was just

266
00:13:54,739 --> 00:13:55,779
like, yeah.

267
00:13:55,779 --> 00:13:58,259
>> Will: And it's not even just like. I mean, I was like,

268
00:13:58,259 --> 00:14:00,419
they couldn't get him the mold or maybe it's just,

269
00:14:00,419 --> 00:14:02,859
you know, I guess. Yeah, yeah. But also too that.

270
00:14:02,859 --> 00:14:04,819
Just real quick, I noticed they updated the

271
00:14:04,819 --> 00:14:07,099
tapestry at the beginning of the episode, too, to

272
00:14:07,099 --> 00:14:10,159
have Kristian in this story there. He did get his

273
00:14:10,159 --> 00:14:12,639
moment of glory. He's. He's in the tapestry at the

274
00:14:12,639 --> 00:14:13,439
beginning of the show.

275
00:14:13,519 --> 00:14:16,719
>> Sarah : We also. And you were right. So Corliss just got

276
00:14:16,719 --> 00:14:20,039
captured at the end of last week's episode. And

277
00:14:20,039 --> 00:14:25,479
that is the. Well, that is maybe one. But as we

278
00:14:25,479 --> 00:14:27,759
find out at the end of the episode, not the only

279
00:14:27,999 --> 00:14:33,719
piece that Ormond has on the chessboard that is

280
00:14:33,719 --> 00:14:36,719
being brought in over to his side. Now. Corliss is

281
00:14:36,719 --> 00:14:40,689
against his will. That's very, very clear in this

282
00:14:40,689 --> 00:14:44,769
exchange that they have as he's captive. And I

283
00:14:44,769 --> 00:14:49,409
just. His question is just so good. What do you

284
00:14:49,409 --> 00:14:52,509
see in them? and the Targaryen element. Why do you

285
00:14:52,509 --> 00:14:55,149
continue to align yourself with the brutish and

286
00:14:55,149 --> 00:14:59,669
the incurious? I also. I wish that it wasn't as

287
00:14:59,669 --> 00:15:02,709
poetic and. And I really just wanted him to say,

288
00:15:02,709 --> 00:15:05,829
but this is so not Mormon. But just be like, you

289
00:15:05,829 --> 00:15:09,189
realize that they took everything from you. Your.

290
00:15:09,429 --> 00:15:12,889
Your loss. Like, you're. They're no longer the

291
00:15:12,889 --> 00:15:17,129
strong ally here. But what is that tie? And I

292
00:15:17,129 --> 00:15:20,129
think it was a smart writing decision to have

293
00:15:20,209 --> 00:15:24,649
Corliss not say anything and to be like, I need. I

294
00:15:24,649 --> 00:15:26,409
want to go back to my chamber. I'm done with this

295
00:15:26,409 --> 00:15:29,649
conversation. Because he knows all of this. He has

296
00:15:29,649 --> 00:15:35,249
that with Frenera early on this season. And yet he

297
00:15:35,409 --> 00:15:39,149
still. Because at the end of the day, he still has

298
00:15:39,469 --> 00:15:45,309
granddaughters and now sons who are on that side.

299
00:15:45,549 --> 00:15:47,989
>> Will: It doesn't matter. I mean. And, you know, to your

300
00:15:47,989 --> 00:15:49,869
point about the writing decision for Corliss not

301
00:15:49,869 --> 00:15:52,308
to say anything, I mean, that. That. That said

302
00:15:52,308 --> 00:15:54,149
everything. It was, you know, to look, you know,

303
00:15:54,149 --> 00:15:55,749
to your point, you know, we haven't mentioned

304
00:15:55,749 --> 00:15:57,869
facial acting in a while here on the pod, but

305
00:15:57,869 --> 00:15:59,709
Corliss the act. Yeah, Steve, Just saying, he

306
00:15:59,709 --> 00:16:01,789
plays Corliss. Like, the facial acting there was

307
00:16:01,789 --> 00:16:03,739
just like, get. Get my wife's name out of your

308
00:16:03,739 --> 00:16:05,019
mouth. Yeah, yeah.

309
00:16:05,019 --> 00:16:06,859
>> Sarah : In the moment you brought up the wife, I was like,

310
00:16:06,859 --> 00:16:09,989
ormond, you need to like, you. You. You had it.

311
00:16:10,309 --> 00:16:14,029
You had him. You. You touched the button. And that

312
00:16:14,029 --> 00:16:18,188
wasn't the card to play, sir. Because even though

313
00:16:18,188 --> 00:16:21,709
Corliss was unfaithful he still. We, we know how

314
00:16:21,709 --> 00:16:23,669
much love there was between those two.

315
00:16:23,749 --> 00:16:26,509
>> Will: Yeah. And yeah, he's yeah. And even with all that,

316
00:16:26,509 --> 00:16:28,549
he's not going to betray them. But we were right

317
00:16:28,549 --> 00:16:31,479
about Corlys being captured, but we were wrong

318
00:16:31,479 --> 00:16:34,959
about the whispers. Whisperers. And in King's

319
00:16:34,959 --> 00:16:37,079
Landing who was going to get the stories back to

320
00:16:37,159 --> 00:16:39,519
Foreman about what happened. But to your point,

321
00:16:39,519 --> 00:16:41,279
there was another piece of the chessboard.

322
00:16:41,279 --> 00:16:43,239
>> Sarah : Well, I. Wait, we were wrong?

323
00:16:43,239 --> 00:16:46,159
>> Will: Well yeah, because remember we thought Corliss. We

324
00:16:46,159 --> 00:16:49,319
thought that Ormond was going to try to like you

325
00:16:49,319 --> 00:16:52,159
know, you had heard about. I took that scene of

326
00:16:52,159 --> 00:16:54,869
Corlys of Ormond, not knowing about the

327
00:16:54,869 --> 00:16:58,629
conversation between and Corlys as far as like the

328
00:16:58,629 --> 00:17:01,469
bastards conversation. Yeah. But I do. But he did.

329
00:17:01,469 --> 00:17:05,309
But we do learn later that whenever he and Ulf

330
00:17:05,309 --> 00:17:08,589
were, were sitting there having having Ls

331
00:17:08,589 --> 00:17:11,389
together, that word did get back about Damon.

332
00:17:11,389 --> 00:17:14,909
Basically embarrassing Ulf in, in, in Old Town,

333
00:17:14,909 --> 00:17:17,319
but in the commoner's area of of King's Landing.

334
00:17:17,319 --> 00:17:20,239
So, so there were you know, so we, we, we had the

335
00:17:20,239 --> 00:17:22,129
right faults, but it was just it was just someone

336
00:17:22,129 --> 00:17:24,169
else instead of Corlys. We were as far as the

337
00:17:24,169 --> 00:17:26,209
spies getting word back to Ormond about what's

338
00:17:26,209 --> 00:17:29,389
going on there at King' admit to

339
00:17:29,389 --> 00:17:32,389
>> Sarah : no being wrong about things.

340
00:17:32,789 --> 00:17:36,229
>> Will: So I, I, I have, I am not afraid to say when I'm

341
00:17:36,229 --> 00:17:37,189
wrong and I will drop.

342
00:17:37,189 --> 00:17:42,069
>> Sarah : Will says we. He means him. So I, I just want to

343
00:17:42,069 --> 00:17:44,109
go back to that. I feel like I was wrong about one

344
00:17:44,109 --> 00:17:46,029
thing but not the other thing that you're trying

345
00:17:46,029 --> 00:17:47,669
to say. And so that's why I'm just.

346
00:17:47,669 --> 00:17:49,589
>> Will: No, no, no no. Don't don't even go there. Because

347
00:17:49,669 --> 00:17:51,909
you, you thought Corliss was dead. You did.

348
00:17:52,149 --> 00:17:54,829
>> Sarah : Yeah, I know. And I said we were wrong. I've

349
00:17:54,829 --> 00:17:57,739
admitted that I didn't think he was wrong. Aware

350
00:17:57,899 --> 00:18:00,899
of when I was wrong. You've lost me in some of

351
00:18:00,899 --> 00:18:05,379
this thread. So to go back to the Alpha at all. It

352
00:18:05,379 --> 00:18:06,779
didn't surprise me though.

353
00:18:07,099 --> 00:18:10,819
Like the whole exchange it made complete sense in

354
00:18:10,819 --> 00:18:14,059
terms of what we were seeing. And there, there we

355
00:18:14,059 --> 00:18:18,059
knew that Ulf was not all in he been the cry. He,

356
00:18:18,219 --> 00:18:21,419
he's been pretty much given the Allison treatment

357
00:18:21,659 --> 00:18:25,419
in King's Landing and with Ray, he keeps moaning

358
00:18:25,419 --> 00:18:28,979
about that. And then the incident between Damon

359
00:18:28,979 --> 00:18:32,349
and him last week, it makes all the sense in the

360
00:18:32,349 --> 00:18:36,949
world. And you kind of also. There was just him

361
00:18:36,949 --> 00:18:41,029
and his realization like he'll never get a castle

362
00:18:41,029 --> 00:18:44,949
or a title. So they've been Very clear. And in

363
00:18:44,949 --> 00:18:48,229
fact, this season, the writers have done a good

364
00:18:48,229 --> 00:18:51,309
job about making sure we understand the

365
00:18:51,309 --> 00:18:55,989
motivations for all of Ren. Allies, because those

366
00:18:55,989 --> 00:19:00,269
motivations at one point were strong and that's

367
00:19:00,269 --> 00:19:03,509
why they fled to her side. But over the course,

368
00:19:03,589 --> 00:19:06,709
ever since she has sat, on that throne, there's

369
00:19:06,709 --> 00:19:10,869
been nothing but shakiness and shaky ground

370
00:19:10,869 --> 00:19:14,429
between her and the allies. So. And Oramond

371
00:19:14,509 --> 00:19:18,589
Ormond, knowing that there's a political game at

372
00:19:18,589 --> 00:19:22,829
play, he. He is using. And I mean, Aemond even

373
00:19:22,829 --> 00:19:26,149
says it in this. In this episode. Those riders

374
00:19:26,149 --> 00:19:28,749
that Rhaenyra has are commoners.

375
00:19:28,989 --> 00:19:29,469
>> Will: Yeah.

376
00:19:29,629 --> 00:19:33,869
>> Sarah : So. So there's not as much. The loyalty of blood

377
00:19:33,949 --> 00:19:37,759
is all, will always be stronger than just. And.

378
00:19:37,759 --> 00:19:40,599
And the irony is there's technically is blood

379
00:19:40,599 --> 00:19:45,879
there. However, they were not raised as nobles or

380
00:19:45,879 --> 00:19:49,679
lords, so. So they're. They're in it like it's a.

381
00:19:49,679 --> 00:19:53,159
It's. It's very different. So. I like that scene

382
00:19:53,159 --> 00:19:57,699
and I like that mom. Like, even more though, was

383
00:19:58,179 --> 00:20:03,299
the scene between Wayne and his nephew because it

384
00:20:03,299 --> 00:20:04,579
just echoes.

385
00:20:05,219 --> 00:20:09,219
And this whole idea, like, you can tell in these

386
00:20:09,219 --> 00:20:12,979
moments how much of an impact Sir Kristian had on

387
00:20:12,979 --> 00:20:16,439
Gwen. we don't. We didn't really get a lot of him

388
00:20:16,759 --> 00:20:21,559
before this season. However, I do feel like his

389
00:20:21,719 --> 00:20:25,779
time there with alongside Sir Kristian, like,

390
00:20:26,169 --> 00:20:27,609
really has changed him.

391
00:20:27,849 --> 00:20:28,329
>> Will: Yeah.

392
00:20:28,329 --> 00:20:32,929
>> Sarah : And, and, and just this, this lovely idea of the

393
00:20:32,929 --> 00:20:35,929
dreams some have of covering themselves in

394
00:20:35,929 --> 00:20:39,449
everlasting glory, of somehow transcending

395
00:20:39,609 --> 00:20:43,609
humanity's common fate, which can be applied to

396
00:20:43,609 --> 00:20:47,689
basically every single character because we. We

397
00:20:47,689 --> 00:20:51,289
see that whether it be wanting, the wanting

398
00:20:51,849 --> 00:20:56,369
something or someone to tell her the gods did want

399
00:20:56,369 --> 00:20:59,889
this. Like she wants that confirmation and she

400
00:20:59,889 --> 00:21:04,089
wants that. That righteous being appointed

401
00:21:04,169 --> 00:21:09,489
righteously or. Or even Aemond or even Aegon. And

402
00:21:09,489 --> 00:21:12,849
then you have Alicent who's like a mother who's

403
00:21:12,849 --> 00:21:17,969
just trying to protect at least one. Like she. A

404
00:21:17,969 --> 00:21:22,449
mother who is. Who's been basically torn, cut up,

405
00:21:22,609 --> 00:21:25,609
put back together, Frankenstein and is just like,

406
00:21:25,609 --> 00:21:28,169
I don't know anything anymore. She's like

407
00:21:28,169 --> 00:21:32,809
completely untethered in this moment. But. But

408
00:21:32,809 --> 00:21:36,409
it's all about like, how will they remember me at

409
00:21:36,409 --> 00:21:39,169
the end of the day? And I mean, if Gwain really

410
00:21:39,169 --> 00:21:41,609
wants a lesson from Sir Kristian, if anything's

411
00:21:41,609 --> 00:21:44,029
gonna happen in Westeros, if there's any truth,

412
00:21:44,109 --> 00:21:46,629
you ain't. It ain't gonna end the way you want it

413
00:21:46,629 --> 00:21:46,909
to.

414
00:21:46,909 --> 00:21:49,069
>> Will: Exactly. Yeah, I thought that. Yeah, I really

415
00:21:49,069 --> 00:21:51,509
enjoyed it. I know they weren't featured too

416
00:21:51,509 --> 00:21:54,229
deeply in this episode as far as the screen time,

417
00:21:54,229 --> 00:21:57,269
but it was a pretty powerful conversation between

418
00:21:57,269 --> 00:21:59,789
Darren and. It also. And Orman and. Excuse me,

419
00:21:59,789 --> 00:22:03,589
Darren and Gawain about Ormond as well as the

420
00:22:03,589 --> 00:22:07,139
motivations of. Of Orman and, you know, Gawain

421
00:22:07,139 --> 00:22:09,299
having. And Darren in particular having

422
00:22:09,849 --> 00:22:12,009
realizations as far as, like, you know, one of the

423
00:22:12,009 --> 00:22:14,049
things that stuck out to me with Darren was like,

424
00:22:14,049 --> 00:22:15,849
I don't want, you know, he was like, I'll be fine

425
00:22:15,849 --> 00:22:18,369
without the crown. You know, he. He. Yeah. You

426
00:22:18,369 --> 00:22:21,569
know, and so that, you know, so I really liked. We

427
00:22:21,569 --> 00:22:24,409
got a real glimpse into Darren understanding, you

428
00:22:24,409 --> 00:22:27,049
know, what the plan is here between, you know,

429
00:22:27,049 --> 00:22:29,249
they're there with. With Ormond and you know how

430
00:22:29,249 --> 00:22:31,009
he was just trying to use them for his own, you

431
00:22:31,009 --> 00:22:32,489
know, to. For his own end.

432
00:22:32,489 --> 00:22:36,539
>> Sarah : Yeah. No, and. And you're right, like Darren. And

433
00:22:36,539 --> 00:22:39,579
we knew it. We've. We already know that Darren was

434
00:22:39,579 --> 00:22:41,969
like, I don't. I don't like where this is going.

435
00:22:41,969 --> 00:22:46,089
But there's a few things of why. And that's one,

436
00:22:46,169 --> 00:22:50,129
he's being forced into it by Ormond. Two, he's

437
00:22:50,129 --> 00:22:52,529
grown up outside of King's Landing.

438
00:22:52,529 --> 00:22:52,849
>> Will: Yeah.

439
00:22:52,849 --> 00:22:56,689
>> Sarah : And he's been around someone. Ormond, who has

440
00:22:56,689 --> 00:23:00,369
basically probably been. Just been like, yeah, you

441
00:23:00,369 --> 00:23:03,989
go there and then this happens. Like, if you're an

442
00:23:03,989 --> 00:23:06,989
intelligent kid, you're probably looking at the

443
00:23:06,989 --> 00:23:10,109
whole situation going on in Kingsland and being

444
00:23:10,109 --> 00:23:13,189
like, I am perfectly fine right here. I don't want

445
00:23:13,189 --> 00:23:16,109
any of that. I don't need to. My brothers are

446
00:23:16,109 --> 00:23:18,949
killing each other. I don't want any part of that.

447
00:23:19,349 --> 00:23:21,429
So I'm just gonna be over here.

448
00:23:21,509 --> 00:23:24,349
>> Will: I'm just gonna sit over here, just me to Sarah,

449
00:23:24,349 --> 00:23:26,229
and we're just gonna do our thing.

450
00:23:26,869 --> 00:23:31,389
>> Sarah : And he also. He also isn't willing to leave

451
00:23:31,389 --> 00:23:36,159
Tumbleton to ruin. He's not willing. Like, he may

452
00:23:36,159 --> 00:23:39,359
despise Ormond and if it was just Ormond, he would

453
00:23:39,359 --> 00:23:42,439
leave. He would have left Ormond ages ago. But

454
00:23:42,439 --> 00:23:45,599
it's the other men who are there who are sworn

455
00:23:45,999 --> 00:23:49,039
quote, unquote, loyalty to him, that he's just

456
00:23:49,039 --> 00:23:52,199
like, I can't abandon them. And. And I think

457
00:23:52,199 --> 00:23:55,839
that's where Gwain, as we've said before, given

458
00:23:55,919 --> 00:23:59,519
his tutelage under Sir Kristian, understands that

459
00:23:59,519 --> 00:24:04,319
now where I think he wouldn't have before prior to

460
00:24:04,319 --> 00:24:08,359
his battle experience. But yeah, I think we. We

461
00:24:08,359 --> 00:24:11,079
get just enough of what's going on in Tumbleton

462
00:24:11,079 --> 00:24:13,759
each episode because we know they're going to be

463
00:24:13,759 --> 00:24:16,519
heavily featured in the finale. So. Yeah. Yeah.

464
00:24:16,519 --> 00:24:19,919
Allison, let's talk about the murder. so a few

465
00:24:19,919 --> 00:24:23,399
things about this, it got my laugh out loud moment

466
00:24:23,399 --> 00:24:26,689
of the episode was Alice's reading a, wine

467
00:24:26,689 --> 00:24:28,039
delivery of, idiot.

468
00:24:28,039 --> 00:24:29,689
>> Will: Yeah, he really is. Yeah.

469
00:24:30,239 --> 00:24:34,159
>> Sarah : But I also the. When she gives him the poison,

470
00:24:34,959 --> 00:24:38,799
they have this exchange. And he says before taking

471
00:24:38,799 --> 00:24:42,799
it, like, but I killed my. But I tried, all right?

472
00:24:42,879 --> 00:24:46,399
But I killed my brother. And I feel like in that

473
00:24:46,399 --> 00:24:50,039
moment, by him saying that, by him taking this

474
00:24:50,039 --> 00:24:53,729
moment of, being like, she tells me, you can't be

475
00:24:53,729 --> 00:24:57,229
trusted. But I also tried to kill my own brother.

476
00:24:58,029 --> 00:25:01,749
So I'm gonna take this poison because I feel like

477
00:25:01,749 --> 00:25:05,549
he knew what it was. And he's like, by me taking

478
00:25:05,629 --> 00:25:10,349
this, you can never hold. And if I recover and

479
00:25:10,349 --> 00:25:13,869
survive this, you can never hold the fact that I

480
00:25:13,869 --> 00:25:17,149
tried to kill Aegon over my head. Like, it was

481
00:25:17,149 --> 00:25:21,069
like, mother, I know you're mad at me, but you

482
00:25:21,069 --> 00:25:24,499
can't be mad at me anymore because FYI, you are

483
00:25:24,499 --> 00:25:25,939
trying to kill me in this moment, and I'm

484
00:25:25,939 --> 00:25:26,579
accepting it.

485
00:25:26,579 --> 00:25:29,669
>> Will: I don't know if I, thought he knew that she was

486
00:25:29,669 --> 00:25:32,109
trying to poison him. I mean, I did cross my mind,

487
00:25:32,109 --> 00:25:34,909
but you know, with the drink. But I, you know,

488
00:25:34,909 --> 00:25:36,949
Heron hall does some strange things to people.

489
00:25:36,949 --> 00:25:40,829
But, you know, hats off to Alicent to recognize

490
00:25:40,829 --> 00:25:43,389
the berries whenever she, whenever she did leave

491
00:25:43,389 --> 00:25:45,959
the castle. And I guess Helena, or somewhere she,

492
00:25:45,959 --> 00:25:47,839
you know, maybe I think it was Helena that like,

493
00:25:47,839 --> 00:25:50,089
you know, they were picking up those things to

494
00:25:50,329 --> 00:25:52,639
know that that was, you know, poison. But, yeah, I

495
00:25:52,639 --> 00:25:54,999
did. I don't know if I read it that way. I, I, I,

496
00:25:54,999 --> 00:25:57,479
I think he's just, you know, like we were, as you

497
00:25:57,479 --> 00:26:00,279
were saying earlier, so we, we get these, you

498
00:26:00,279 --> 00:26:03,559
know, Damon and even have these parallel things

499
00:26:03,559 --> 00:26:05,519
happening to them. And so, you know, in this

500
00:26:05,519 --> 00:26:08,999
Harrenhal moment, he was just, I don't know, you

501
00:26:08,999 --> 00:26:12,039
know, he was. His mommy issues or whatever were

502
00:26:12,279 --> 00:26:14,599
taken over there and he was just, you know, having

503
00:26:14,599 --> 00:26:16,519
this weird, like, we're going to have this big

504
00:26:16,519 --> 00:26:19,929
happy family here. You know, Mom's here. I have

505
00:26:19,929 --> 00:26:23,009
my, you know, the woman who's gonna bear my kids

506
00:26:23,009 --> 00:26:27,209
and, and myself here that to. In this castle.

507
00:26:27,529 --> 00:26:32,249
>> Sarah : See, See, that would have been mine read if she

508
00:26:32,249 --> 00:26:35,369
had done it like before when they were all eating

509
00:26:35,369 --> 00:26:37,849
dinner and then they get into an argument and she

510
00:26:37,849 --> 00:26:41,169
realizes, but if you. Because, and I didn't have

511
00:26:41,169 --> 00:26:43,849
this read initially, I had to think about this,

512
00:26:44,009 --> 00:26:47,209
but it did stick out in my mind. Why did he say

513
00:26:47,209 --> 00:26:50,729
that? Why did they have the character in that

514
00:26:50,729 --> 00:26:55,889
moment when this is him and his mom? Aegon is like

515
00:26:56,209 --> 00:26:59,489
far off in the distance, like a memory far away.

516
00:26:59,729 --> 00:27:03,209
He brings up and acknowledges the fact that at the

517
00:27:03,209 --> 00:27:06,689
end of the day, he did try to murder Aegon to his

518
00:27:06,769 --> 00:27:08,289
mom. He acknowledges that.

519
00:27:08,289 --> 00:27:08,649
>> Will: Yes.

520
00:27:08,649 --> 00:27:11,649
>> Sarah : So the very fact that they had him say that,

521
00:27:11,649 --> 00:27:15,369
that's why I started thinking about it and

522
00:27:15,369 --> 00:27:18,249
thinking, like. I think that's a sign that he

523
00:27:18,249 --> 00:27:18,609
knew.

524
00:27:18,609 --> 00:27:19,049
>> Will: Yeah.

525
00:27:19,129 --> 00:27:23,889
>> Sarah : He also knows what Alice is capable of. So I think

526
00:27:23,889 --> 00:27:27,049
he. And the fact that they had the berries, like,

527
00:27:27,049 --> 00:27:29,449
she didn't wander outside of the castle. They were

528
00:27:29,449 --> 00:27:33,449
basically within the walls. She was just like.

529
00:27:33,449 --> 00:27:36,369
They weren't very far. Okay. At the end of the

530
00:27:36,369 --> 00:27:40,929
day, so. So Alice. And Alice has been there her

531
00:27:40,929 --> 00:27:43,409
entire life and knows exactly what's growing. And

532
00:27:43,409 --> 00:27:46,589
she probably planted seeds. I. I think she has a

533
00:27:46,589 --> 00:27:49,429
cure right away. And that's also why she just said

534
00:27:49,429 --> 00:27:53,189
idiot, because she knew. Knows how to fix this. So

535
00:27:53,269 --> 00:27:57,199
I. That is my interpretation. But, they did get

536
00:27:57,199 --> 00:27:59,959
me. Unfortunate. Well, they did, but they didn't.

537
00:27:59,959 --> 00:28:00,478
Okay.

538
00:28:00,478 --> 00:28:04,359
And here. Here's my case for it. The whole Allison

539
00:28:04,359 --> 00:28:07,799
arriving at Heron Hall. Okay. Right. When Allison

540
00:28:07,959 --> 00:28:11,399
appears, I think to myself, I literally had this

541
00:28:11,399 --> 00:28:14,619
thought. I was like, how the fuck did she not get

542
00:28:14,619 --> 00:28:17,659
by Alice? Like, are we gonna see that interaction?

543
00:28:17,739 --> 00:28:22,299
Because any time up until this point, we have seen

544
00:28:22,379 --> 00:28:25,059
all sorts of people try to get into Heron hall and

545
00:28:25,059 --> 00:28:28,059
immediately get confronted by Alice. Right.

546
00:28:28,378 --> 00:28:28,939
>> Will: Yep.

547
00:28:29,099 --> 00:28:32,019
>> Sarah : So. So the fact that they didn't show, that stuck

548
00:28:32,019 --> 00:28:36,019
out in my mind. Then when they started kissing, I

549
00:28:36,019 --> 00:28:39,969
was like, whoa, this is Alice. Allison. I was

550
00:28:39,969 --> 00:28:42,169
like, I don't know if you want to do that before

551
00:28:42,249 --> 00:28:45,489
you stab him. I. I don't know. And then it was

552
00:28:45,489 --> 00:28:49,569
kind of like, like, okay, I understand now. That

553
00:28:49,569 --> 00:28:50,409
is Allison.

554
00:28:51,129 --> 00:28:54,128
>> Will: Yeah, they got me. Yeah. Yeah. Got. Yeah. You

555
00:28:54,128 --> 00:28:55,369
know, again, the parallels.

556
00:28:55,449 --> 00:28:56,369
>> Sarah : Right, Right.

557
00:28:56,369 --> 00:28:59,169
>> Will: Yeah. Since Damon had had division last year, now

558
00:28:59,169 --> 00:29:01,849
we got this. And I was like, Ah, yeah, yeah, but

559
00:29:01,849 --> 00:29:03,929
that's a good but. Yeah, but that's a good flag

560
00:29:03,929 --> 00:29:07,129
there, that general. Yeah. Usually Alice does

561
00:29:07,129 --> 00:29:10,649
catch the people trying to come into the hall, but

562
00:29:10,649 --> 00:29:13,209
she was otherwise occupied when Allison first

563
00:29:13,209 --> 00:29:13,649
arrived.

564
00:29:13,649 --> 00:29:18,009
>> Sarah : Yeah. Yeah. No, and it was my honest to God first

565
00:29:18,009 --> 00:29:21,649
thought, because we all know that I'm still on the

566
00:29:21,649 --> 00:29:24,449
side. Helena should have went. I wanted to see

567
00:29:24,449 --> 00:29:28,409
Alice and Helen interact. But no, Helena did not

568
00:29:28,409 --> 00:29:31,649
go to kill her own brother. Instead, we have

569
00:29:31,649 --> 00:29:35,889
Helena remaining captive, a very important person

570
00:29:36,589 --> 00:29:39,309
in this episode. The episode is kind of named

571
00:29:39,309 --> 00:29:42,029
after her in a way, because the episode's name is

572
00:29:42,029 --> 00:29:43,309
the dragon in Winter.

573
00:29:44,109 --> 00:29:48,069
And we start. We start and we end with a dream. I

574
00:29:48,069 --> 00:29:50,309
really I really kind of wish they would have

575
00:29:50,309 --> 00:29:54,429
legitimately ended with this whole dream sequence.

576
00:29:54,429 --> 00:29:57,589
But we start with a dream that Helena is having

577
00:29:57,589 --> 00:29:59,829
and she's woken up by Ren. And then they have a

578
00:29:59,829 --> 00:30:03,229
conversation about their father because he will

579
00:30:03,229 --> 00:30:07,429
always be remembered. and it's a similar to.

580
00:30:07,509 --> 00:30:10,909
Again, it's a lot of conversations that are had in

581
00:30:10,909 --> 00:30:13,749
these later episodes are returning to previous

582
00:30:13,909 --> 00:30:17,749
conversations because they are continuing to weave

583
00:30:17,749 --> 00:30:21,349
these themes and these ideas of perspective and

584
00:30:21,429 --> 00:30:24,389
what you want versus the reality of having it.

585
00:30:24,479 --> 00:30:28,719
and. And in this. In. In this exchange, it's about

586
00:30:28,959 --> 00:30:32,159
his perspectives that has also been previously

587
00:30:32,159 --> 00:30:37,259
discussed on dragons. And, it's kind of been like

588
00:30:37,499 --> 00:30:41,339
he didn't. This. Basically, Helena says he,

589
00:30:41,499 --> 00:30:44,379
meaning Viserys, did not wish to be changed. And

590
00:30:44,379 --> 00:30:47,298
then Rhaenyra says, you believe the dragons alter

591
00:30:47,298 --> 00:30:51,179
us in some way. And then Helena, who. Who very

592
00:30:51,179 --> 00:30:55,339
much is serving in Allison's role right now. Like,

593
00:30:55,339 --> 00:30:57,619
you don't get a Rhaenyra Allison exchange in an

594
00:30:57,619 --> 00:30:59,139
episode move in Helena.

595
00:30:59,139 --> 00:30:59,499
>> Will: Yeah.

596
00:30:59,659 --> 00:31:02,619
>> Sarah : And because she says you now have many dragons,

597
00:31:03,139 --> 00:31:08,099
are you yourself not altered? But that also goes

598
00:31:08,099 --> 00:31:11,699
to. What Allison has continued to try to explain

599
00:31:11,699 --> 00:31:15,059
to Rhaenyra is that just by sitting on that

600
00:31:15,059 --> 00:31:18,979
throne, you are changing and have changed. And

601
00:31:18,979 --> 00:31:23,299
there's a denial, continued denial from Rena that

602
00:31:23,299 --> 00:31:27,059
we finally really start to see expressed by her

603
00:31:27,219 --> 00:31:31,199
verbatim, where she is like, no, I'm. I'm pretty

604
00:31:31,199 --> 00:31:34,799
much the same. It's a similar moment later when

605
00:31:34,799 --> 00:31:38,479
she's confronting Damon about Rhea and is like,

606
00:31:38,719 --> 00:31:41,199
you tried to protect her from what? Like, what am

607
00:31:41,199 --> 00:31:44,279
I like? You. You view me as this monster, and it's

608
00:31:44,279 --> 00:31:46,599
kind of like, well, Rhaenyra, did you see yourself

609
00:31:46,599 --> 00:31:49,439
grieving? You're. You're still also not over it.

610
00:31:49,439 --> 00:31:53,119
Like, so I don't know. But protect me from.

611
00:31:53,609 --> 00:31:56,729
Protect me from what? And then you also. There's.

612
00:31:56,889 --> 00:32:00,179
There's, When she confronts White Worm, also

613
00:32:00,179 --> 00:32:04,059
towards the end of the episode, she says, I know

614
00:32:04,059 --> 00:32:07,419
what you've been doing, which I love. A very love

615
00:32:07,419 --> 00:32:10,509
acknowledgment that Rhaenyra has known that, White

616
00:32:10,509 --> 00:32:13,709
Worm was basically trying to paint her in her

617
00:32:13,709 --> 00:32:17,909
image. Like, you're counseling me, but so that I

618
00:32:18,069 --> 00:32:21,429
can be more like you, not the other way around.

619
00:32:21,509 --> 00:32:24,779
Well, you're around people. They naturally grow on

620
00:32:24,929 --> 00:32:27,529
you, but it's just. It's just good. What.

621
00:32:27,529 --> 00:32:29,929
What did you think about Helena and in this

622
00:32:29,929 --> 00:32:30,449
episode?

623
00:32:30,449 --> 00:32:33,599
>> Will: Yeah, I mean, the, The. Obviously there's. There

624
00:32:33,599 --> 00:32:36,319
was some foreshadowing for sure, but I really.

625
00:32:36,319 --> 00:32:38,719
Whenever I was just listening to talk about the

626
00:32:38,719 --> 00:32:43,319
conversation that and Helena had and just about

627
00:32:43,319 --> 00:32:45,199
the change, you know, as far as. I mean, you

628
00:32:45,199 --> 00:32:47,159
nailed. I mean, I don't really have much more to

629
00:32:47,239 --> 00:32:49,479
say there because you really did nail it really.

630
00:32:49,959 --> 00:32:54,399
Well, as far as, like, how we. We. We've seen over

631
00:32:54,399 --> 00:32:56,909
the course of, this season how Rhaenyra is

632
00:32:57,149 --> 00:33:01,149
getting. Is changing. And really she's coming to

633
00:33:01,149 --> 00:33:04,229
the place where it's like, well, maybe Damon was

634
00:33:04,229 --> 00:33:07,549
right about how. How to rule. Because, you know,

635
00:33:07,549 --> 00:33:09,469
because, you know, we learned in this episode too,

636
00:33:09,469 --> 00:33:11,589
where, you know, she's like, the queen is not

637
00:33:11,589 --> 00:33:14,189
going to have any more petitions right now. And.

638
00:33:14,669 --> 00:33:17,269
And, you know, I think, you know, we really touch

639
00:33:17,269 --> 00:33:20,389
on the court too, you know, that where the. The

640
00:33:20,389 --> 00:33:22,899
guy was like, you're so, you know, he was like,

641
00:33:22,899 --> 00:33:24,739
you're setting me up to be the scapegoat here as

642
00:33:24,739 --> 00:33:27,619
far as the taxes and no money. So, I mean, all

643
00:33:27,619 --> 00:33:30,459
these things are like, she is starting to, like,

644
00:33:30,459 --> 00:33:35,509
get more and more, more. Stronger. Stronger touch

645
00:33:35,509 --> 00:33:39,749
on her rule than. Than she had. Had originally had

646
00:33:39,749 --> 00:33:40,229
hoped.

647
00:33:40,229 --> 00:33:44,549
>> Sarah : So it's kind of like a lot of what Mr. Has said to

648
00:33:44,549 --> 00:33:49,119
do has brought her no good. Like, she's, Mr. Is

649
00:33:49,119 --> 00:33:51,749
one who said, you need to set up somebody as your

650
00:33:51,749 --> 00:33:54,429
fall guy for. For the lack of money. And that's

651
00:33:54,429 --> 00:33:57,229
what she did. And now even that's not working. And

652
00:33:57,229 --> 00:34:00,669
she's. She's even directed them towards the fall

653
00:34:00,669 --> 00:34:04,869
guy and. And she's still hearing complaints. It's

654
00:34:04,869 --> 00:34:08,229
not like they suddenly found the money. Mr. Says,

655
00:34:08,229 --> 00:34:10,829
Listen to the people. Well, we've seen her a few

656
00:34:10,829 --> 00:34:14,029
times, quote, unquote, listen to the people. And

657
00:34:14,349 --> 00:34:16,789
she can't handle it because it's all noise and

658
00:34:16,789 --> 00:34:20,918
it's all like, hey, that's that. I'm sorry you

659
00:34:20,918 --> 00:34:23,318
guys are poor right now, but I need to go get

660
00:34:23,318 --> 00:34:25,918
revenge for my sons. Okay, so take it.

661
00:34:25,918 --> 00:34:27,918
>> Will: Yeah. yeah. And the people are also, you know,

662
00:34:27,918 --> 00:34:30,238
listen to the people. Listen to this. And the

663
00:34:30,238 --> 00:34:33,118
people are feeling even more unsafe in King's

664
00:34:33,118 --> 00:34:35,598
Landing. So everything Messaria has, like, tried

665
00:34:35,598 --> 00:34:38,878
to counsel Rhaenyra to do is not working. So now

666
00:34:38,878 --> 00:34:40,788
Rhaenyra is like, so the comic. Going back to our,

667
00:34:40,788 --> 00:34:43,508
you know, to your question about Atlanta. Yeah. So

668
00:34:43,508 --> 00:34:46,548
Rhaenyra is sort of like. And I love how they

669
00:34:46,548 --> 00:34:49,349
frame it with using the best of focal point, for

670
00:34:49,349 --> 00:34:51,989
obvious reasons, she's realizing like, yeah, I got

671
00:34:51,989 --> 00:34:53,989
it. You know, tell me the answer. You know, you

672
00:34:53,989 --> 00:34:56,629
know, she and Rhaenyra realizes that Helena does

673
00:34:56,629 --> 00:34:59,589
have that ability to see visions. And so she's

674
00:34:59,589 --> 00:35:02,909
just like, tell me, do you Know, do the gods, you

675
00:35:02,909 --> 00:35:04,589
know, am I going to prevail here?

676
00:35:04,829 --> 00:35:05,229
>> Sarah : And.

677
00:35:05,709 --> 00:35:08,309
>> Will: And you know, and it does cut to. Cuts to the

678
00:35:08,309 --> 00:35:09,909
future. I mean, you know, with the, with the

679
00:35:09,909 --> 00:35:12,669
horse, you know, and you see the pale horse and

680
00:35:12,669 --> 00:35:14,269
you can't help but think the religious industry

681
00:35:14,269 --> 00:35:16,109
there as far as the Four Horsemen of the

682
00:35:16,109 --> 00:35:18,379
Apocalypse and, you know, you know, being a

683
00:35:18,599 --> 00:35:20,839
harbinger. Harbinger of death. Especially when,

684
00:35:21,079 --> 00:35:23,279
you know, whenever Helena's other dream is, you

685
00:35:23,279 --> 00:35:26,639
know, we. The clear foreshadowing of winter is

686
00:35:26,639 --> 00:35:28,959
coming. So like you said, I mean, the title pretty

687
00:35:28,959 --> 00:35:31,209
much, tells us what's going to happen here. So.

688
00:35:31,209 --> 00:35:32,929
Yeah, so, you know, you have those moments and

689
00:35:32,929 --> 00:35:35,649
then the other imagery and dreams that Helena had,

690
00:35:35,649 --> 00:35:38,489
as far as seeing Dreamfire and melting dream fire

691
00:35:38,569 --> 00:35:40,849
for some. Maybe some future battle and, you know,

692
00:35:40,849 --> 00:35:42,769
in the childbirth, you know, so you had that image

693
00:35:42,769 --> 00:35:45,129
as well. And clearly it was a male error because,

694
00:35:45,599 --> 00:35:47,839
you know, soldiers took him away. So there was

695
00:35:47,839 --> 00:35:50,199
just so many things packed into Helena. The only

696
00:35:50,199 --> 00:35:51,559
thing that I wish, like you said, I wish we could

697
00:35:51,559 --> 00:35:53,599
have was this a scene with Helena and Alice.

698
00:35:53,599 --> 00:35:56,639
>> Sarah : Yeah, yeah, it was. The. The last scene is when it

699
00:35:56,639 --> 00:35:59,319
goes from the child being taken away to Dream

700
00:35:59,319 --> 00:36:03,999
Fighter and her sighting against an army to a very

701
00:36:03,999 --> 00:36:07,639
calm, peaceful field that suddenly goes from like

702
00:36:07,639 --> 00:36:11,159
summer to winter in a matter of minutes. Yeah,

703
00:36:11,159 --> 00:36:13,959
and. But. And I like how you said foreshadowing of

704
00:36:13,959 --> 00:36:15,979
winter is coming and I'm like, yeah, that's.

705
00:36:16,049 --> 00:36:18,569
That's long foreshadowing because that's like 200

706
00:36:18,569 --> 00:36:19,889
years in the 200 years.

707
00:36:19,889 --> 00:36:23,169
>> Will: But, but Danny is a descendant of Raniera, so.

708
00:36:23,889 --> 00:36:26,769
>> Sarah : Yeah, yeah, but like you're talking about

709
00:36:26,769 --> 00:36:28,289
foreshadowing 200 years.

710
00:36:30,449 --> 00:36:31,928
>> Will: Yeah, I know you're cool. But they did it last.

711
00:36:31,928 --> 00:36:33,849
They did it last season two with the, with the

712
00:36:33,849 --> 00:36:35,569
Starks on the wall. So, I mean, you know, they've

713
00:36:35,569 --> 00:36:39,249
been doing it with Jace, so always do it. Let's do

714
00:36:39,249 --> 00:36:39,609
it. Yeah.

715
00:36:39,609 --> 00:36:42,129
>> Sarah : We want to talk about Aegon. Aegon. What to say?

716
00:36:42,129 --> 00:36:46,129
He. He makes his stand. He gives his speech, his

717
00:36:46,129 --> 00:36:50,769
rally cry. And you know, we should have believed

718
00:36:50,769 --> 00:36:53,329
him earlier when he said that Sunfire was still

719
00:36:53,329 --> 00:36:55,969
alive because Sunfyre has risen. And, it was a

720
00:36:55,969 --> 00:36:59,209
beautiful moment for Aegon. I love Aegon, so. I

721
00:36:59,209 --> 00:37:04,609
mean, I don't love him, but he. He. I'm sorry, he

722
00:37:04,769 --> 00:37:08,569
is. Mangled face has a very secret, like, special

723
00:37:08,569 --> 00:37:09,409
place in my heart.

724
00:37:09,489 --> 00:37:12,169
>> Will: I have to say. As, ah, the season has progressed,

725
00:37:12,399 --> 00:37:14,919
he has grown on me. I'm not quite ready to go, you

726
00:37:14,919 --> 00:37:17,359
know, change Shirts from team black to team Green.

727
00:37:17,359 --> 00:37:20,359
But, but. But he had. He has definitely grown on

728
00:37:20,359 --> 00:37:24,519
me. And I love the interplay there between the

729
00:37:24,519 --> 00:37:26,839
Three Stooges. You had Tylan, at the end of the

730
00:37:26,839 --> 00:37:28,799
day, being the real one, you know, he's Master

731
00:37:28,799 --> 00:37:31,279
Coin. I couldn't help but also think when Aegon

732
00:37:31,279 --> 00:37:33,559
was a little kid, you know, he was the one when

733
00:37:33,559 --> 00:37:35,319
Aegon was, like, messing with. With Tyler when

734
00:37:35,319 --> 00:37:37,319
they had to put the little stone. And so there was

735
00:37:37,319 --> 00:37:39,119
that, you know, and then, of course, he was the

736
00:37:39,119 --> 00:37:41,319
one that stood by him. Of course, Laris. Laris was

737
00:37:41,319 --> 00:37:44,459
Laris. And this Sal. Picture that we' tell good

738
00:37:44,459 --> 00:37:46,779
stories about you and stuff. But it was. It was

739
00:37:46,779 --> 00:37:48,859
really, really cool scene, I have to say.

740
00:37:48,859 --> 00:37:52,699
>> Sarah : Yeah. Yeah, it. And like, even. Like you said,

741
00:37:52,699 --> 00:37:56,499
even Lannister is growing on me in this moment

742
00:37:56,499 --> 00:38:00,739
when he chooses to stay with Aegon. And I. I love

743
00:38:00,739 --> 00:38:04,539
Larys because Larys is like, I'm out. And then

744
00:38:04,539 --> 00:38:07,259
you're. You're like, really, dude? And then he

745
00:38:07,339 --> 00:38:10,919
gives his logic, and even Aegon accepts Epson.

746
00:38:10,919 --> 00:38:13,999
He's a cripple. He. He. He will do nothing. Just

747
00:38:13,999 --> 00:38:17,239
like I'm gonna do nothing in this fight. But I. I

748
00:38:17,239 --> 00:38:21,079
get it. So I just. Their understanding of each

749
00:38:21,079 --> 00:38:23,759
other is really beautiful. And, you know, Lars is

750
00:38:23,759 --> 00:38:28,759
gonna come. Come back, and I. I just. I'm very. I.

751
00:38:28,839 --> 00:38:31,519
I'm very interested to see where. Where these

752
00:38:31,519 --> 00:38:34,719
three go and navigate, especially now that they

753
00:38:34,719 --> 00:38:38,559
have a dragon on their side. And you know what? In

754
00:38:38,559 --> 00:38:41,599
my opinion, rooting for Aegon, you're not rooting

755
00:38:41,599 --> 00:38:44,039
for Team Green because Team Green tried to kill

756
00:38:44,039 --> 00:38:45,119
Aegon. Okay.

757
00:38:45,119 --> 00:38:47,799
>> Will: True. Yeah. Team Aegon now. Yeah. So it's fully

758
00:38:47,799 --> 00:38:48,599
Team Aegon.

759
00:38:48,839 --> 00:38:52,199
>> Sarah : Yeah. Yeah. All right, well, that is it for us in

760
00:38:52,199 --> 00:38:53,719
House of the Dragon,

761
00:39:02,129 --> 00:39:14,459
>> Will: Sam.